“Our wisdom traditions that focus on a supreme creator are much more comprehensible...” Indeed. And it’s part of the function of each myth to help us comprehend some aspect of the nature of “everything.” Unfortunately, the term “myth” seems poorly understood by many to mean fiction, or misunderstanding, and seems to have been taken as history by others.
“...no conflict between science and religion...” Francis Collins, the lead scientist on the Human Genome Project, was brought up by atheist parents. He had a born-again experience and adopted Christianity. His take on science in general and evolution in particular is that it’s just God’s way of accomplishing things.
I’m curious about Swimme’s book. There are reviews that say things like “Page after page one is treated to every step of the author’s daily activities, from what meal he ate to what gas station he stopped at.” Would you say that Swimme managed to work the details of life convincingly into the big picture, or does he belabor those details?
It’s an interesting question about Swimme … first of all his memory is beyond incredible. The book is definitely an unusual style, especially for a scientist. The story he tells fascinates me and part of it comes from the way he deals with his own transformation and passion. Since it was his story to tell, I’m just trying to sort it all out for myself by going back to Thomas Berry, and other cosmologists. Also looking forward to hearing him in person in September.
Maybe it’s the poet in me, but once, when sitting on a beach near Larnaca at sunset after a late afternoon storm, the roiling waters before me were most certainly “a wine dark sea.” Words for colors simply didn’t fit. What color is dark, moving water?
I may be as fascinated by origins as you. I am especially interested in biogenesis and the transformation of ideas after the discovery of DNA in the fifties and then the analysis of Darwinian evolution by statisticians and mathematicians in the sixties who asked some very difficult questions about chance and probability and time. The questions have only deepened with advances in cellular biology and the intricacy of microcellular machinery and processes.
We are at a “the earth is not at the center of the solar system” moment and it’s an exciting time. Old ideas no longer seem to fit with the new knowledge. Science is dynamic and resists our need for stasis.
Love your experience with the "wine dark sea." It reminds me to stay aware. All the new data flooding in from the space probes and new thinking does make this a fascinating time.
I love the very word 'cosmogenesis,' Joyce. And also love thinking about everything you mention in this post. Such wonderful food for a thoughtful Wednesday! (and beyond dare I say)? Also, that Homer line, the wine dark sea, I'd heard before that in that time, some color had not yet been acknowledged. It's mind blowing, isn't it? And love your moment as a freshman, standing in the dark silence with a friend, and comprehending the massiveness of the universe. Great post!
It’s … nuanced. Mexico Listo by Mike Leavy gives a good overview. There’s a lot to be determined as with all things political and based south of the border. Let’s talk sometime.
"Origins: Fourteen Billion Years of Cosmic Evolution" (NDT and Donald Goldsmith),
"The Theory of Everything: The Quest to Explain All Reality" by Don Lincoln, both on Audible... but the one I think you should really read is called "The Five Ages of the Universe." Very thinky stuff.
I might also strongly recommend "Origins: Speculations on the Cosmos, Earth, and Mankind." This is much more in your arena of thought, and not just about the cosmos.
From my perspective, the “mess “ we have made may be part of evolution itself. It only becomes a “mess” through judgement and our desire to possess what we think is “good”.
I was glad to read something as 'big' as this today, Joyce, and very pleased you'll be delving into some science. I keep resolving to read some popular science books, as I think my level of understanding is on a par with someone from the Middle Ages!! Trouble is, I am enchanted by stories and can't seem to give them up.
Here in Wales the colour blue is not straightforwardly present in the Welsh language as the word for blue (glas) can also mean green. But it's very complicated and I am not a Welsh speaker, so don't quote me on that!
Thanks, Kathy ... it's a bit of a slog for me ... I'm not building on a firm foundation. Interesting about color in the Welch language. If you decide to delve into the science thing, let me know ... it would be interesting to have a non-science person to talk science with. ;-)
Oh, the places you will go... Thanks for letting us tag along on your journey.
“Our wisdom traditions that focus on a supreme creator are much more comprehensible...” Indeed. And it’s part of the function of each myth to help us comprehend some aspect of the nature of “everything.” Unfortunately, the term “myth” seems poorly understood by many to mean fiction, or misunderstanding, and seems to have been taken as history by others.
“...no conflict between science and religion...” Francis Collins, the lead scientist on the Human Genome Project, was brought up by atheist parents. He had a born-again experience and adopted Christianity. His take on science in general and evolution in particular is that it’s just God’s way of accomplishing things.
I’m curious about Swimme’s book. There are reviews that say things like “Page after page one is treated to every step of the author’s daily activities, from what meal he ate to what gas station he stopped at.” Would you say that Swimme managed to work the details of life convincingly into the big picture, or does he belabor those details?
It’s an interesting question about Swimme … first of all his memory is beyond incredible. The book is definitely an unusual style, especially for a scientist. The story he tells fascinates me and part of it comes from the way he deals with his own transformation and passion. Since it was his story to tell, I’m just trying to sort it all out for myself by going back to Thomas Berry, and other cosmologists. Also looking forward to hearing him in person in September.
Maybe it’s the poet in me, but once, when sitting on a beach near Larnaca at sunset after a late afternoon storm, the roiling waters before me were most certainly “a wine dark sea.” Words for colors simply didn’t fit. What color is dark, moving water?
I may be as fascinated by origins as you. I am especially interested in biogenesis and the transformation of ideas after the discovery of DNA in the fifties and then the analysis of Darwinian evolution by statisticians and mathematicians in the sixties who asked some very difficult questions about chance and probability and time. The questions have only deepened with advances in cellular biology and the intricacy of microcellular machinery and processes.
We are at a “the earth is not at the center of the solar system” moment and it’s an exciting time. Old ideas no longer seem to fit with the new knowledge. Science is dynamic and resists our need for stasis.
Love your experience with the "wine dark sea." It reminds me to stay aware. All the new data flooding in from the space probes and new thinking does make this a fascinating time.
I love the very word 'cosmogenesis,' Joyce. And also love thinking about everything you mention in this post. Such wonderful food for a thoughtful Wednesday! (and beyond dare I say)? Also, that Homer line, the wine dark sea, I'd heard before that in that time, some color had not yet been acknowledged. It's mind blowing, isn't it? And love your moment as a freshman, standing in the dark silence with a friend, and comprehending the massiveness of the universe. Great post!
Thanks, Jeanine … love having these conversations and have been wondering about your take on the new president of Mexico.
It’s … nuanced. Mexico Listo by Mike Leavy gives a good overview. There’s a lot to be determined as with all things political and based south of the border. Let’s talk sometime.
I read that, too ... it was good. Let's do talk sometime soon.
Joyce, I really enjoyed:
"Origins: Fourteen Billion Years of Cosmic Evolution" (NDT and Donald Goldsmith),
"The Theory of Everything: The Quest to Explain All Reality" by Don Lincoln, both on Audible... but the one I think you should really read is called "The Five Ages of the Universe." Very thinky stuff.
I might also strongly recommend "Origins: Speculations on the Cosmos, Earth, and Mankind." This is much more in your arena of thought, and not just about the cosmos.
I hope this helps a little!
Thanks, Andrew … appreciate those additions to my list. My kindle is filling up faster than my head. ;-)
Water everywhere, and more than I could ever drink.
From my perspective, the “mess “ we have made may be part of evolution itself. It only becomes a “mess” through judgement and our desire to possess what we think is “good”.
"mess" is definitely a judgment word ... however, the loss of biodiversity probably fits most definitions of mess.
I was glad to read something as 'big' as this today, Joyce, and very pleased you'll be delving into some science. I keep resolving to read some popular science books, as I think my level of understanding is on a par with someone from the Middle Ages!! Trouble is, I am enchanted by stories and can't seem to give them up.
Here in Wales the colour blue is not straightforwardly present in the Welsh language as the word for blue (glas) can also mean green. But it's very complicated and I am not a Welsh speaker, so don't quote me on that!
Thanks, Kathy ... it's a bit of a slog for me ... I'm not building on a firm foundation. Interesting about color in the Welch language. If you decide to delve into the science thing, let me know ... it would be interesting to have a non-science person to talk science with. ;-)